There are lines. Please stop crossing them.

[seanan_mcguire]

When I posted about depression, I said that I was giving myself comment amnesty; I said that I might not (probably would not) read the comments.

Since then, people have contacted me via email (when they had it), via my old email (which I rarely check), via my contact form, via Facebook, and via my Tumblr, to give me their phone numbers, to tell me not to hurt myself (which I did not threaten to do), to provide crisis hotlines, to make suggestions about medication (which I did not solicit), and in one case, to threaten to report me to the police as a suicide risk if I did not update my blog immediately to show that I was still alive.

Please. Stop. "Comment amnesty" did not mean "work harder to make sure that your words, your well wishes, your specific need to engage with my depression will be heard." I try to keep open dialogs on this blog, and I usually appreciate communication, but right now, this contact is intrusive, and upsetting, and seems to prioritize the needs of the contacting person above mine. Please. Stop.

This is why I do not talk when I am sad.

Comments

[mackknopf.livejournal.com]

Oh, good grief, as Charlie Brown used to say.

I read your post, but decided to wait to reply until or if I had something new or useful to say. I actually went to bed thinking you might most like unrelated Tumblr discussion of Prodigy and other new mutants on teams. Empathy can generally be assumed and is probably drowned out among other voices. I'm not in the habit of telling friends (or clients, for that matter) untrue cliches and well-meant generalities like "things will always get better!". I thought of replying with echoing stories of my own life, then thought, "Seanan has enough to read in this thread."
So I went to bed. :)

I'm of the opinion that we all have the right to decide what criteria will lead us to check out of this mortal coil. If one is in control of one's faculties, then death is everyone's right. I'm talking about the existential forms of rational depression, dissatisfaction with life, What things do we require to stay on this planet? But if I talked about this analysis calmly and rationally, many people would call mental health professionals on me or otherwise act like jackasses. Yet Seneca, Marcus Aurelius, and the other Stoics would have understood exactly what I was talking about. They would have been astounded that people were not making that analyis. Modern culture has sometimes lost certain perspectives on death that the ancient world of Greeks and Romans possessed.

Mack

P.S. Prodigy is still technically depowered, last time I checked -- his abilities are now skill-related, not memetic-copying as per the disconnected mutant power. More on Tumblr when you feel like it. Have you been reading Kieron Gillen's excellent Young Avengers with Prodigy in it?

[groblek.livejournal.com]

Ack! I'm sorry that you have to deal wih people lacking an understanding of appropriate boundaries. I hope they listen to this post, but I wish you hadn't needed to make it.

[geekhyena.livejournal.com]

*offers hugs, or, if preferred, baked goods and hot tea* I'm sorry you had to go through that. It makes it hard to speak out when people treat speaking out like a crisis, and don't respect your autonomy or your own word. That's a really sad violation of your boundaries, and makes their concern sound hollow and self-serving. Best of luck.

[raveneona.livejournal.com]

Your earlier post about your depression was honest and brave. I didn't read it as a sign for help, more as an 'article' (can't think of a better word) saying that depression can happen at any time and that there doesn't need to be something that 'triggers' it. Honestly it reminded me of Vizzini's novel It's Kind of a Funny Story. I'm sorry that you received harassment from those who read your entry as something that you didn't mean it to be.

For what it's worth....

[anderyn.livejournal.com]

My reaction to that post was a heartfelt... yes... depression feels like that, and I'm --- not happy, since I wish you didn't have to feel that way, but pleased, maybe? --- to see someone articulate expressing their experience, and how it all feels from inside. I do wish that you may find peace and surcease from the wonky brain chemistry, and I selfishly hope that you will also stay around for a long time, because I truly enjoy your writing, but --- good Lord. As far as I could tell, there was nothing in the post that said you were feeling actively suicidal NOW, so what the fuck with these interventionist people? And what the fuck with trying to contact you directly when they aren't in your personal life? Good Lord. I respect your right to your own life and the fact that I am not your friend in person. I hope that your real-life friends are supporting you and keeping you sane and alive, but that's all I can reasonably do.

[codevixen.livejournal.com]

I am so sorry that opening up about your experiences has hurt you. I wish you all good things.

[quietchildae.livejournal.com]

(A new commenter here, but a long time reader/lover of your work)

When I woke up this morning, I was so godawful depressed that the only thing I could think to do with myself was go back to bed. And as I lay in bed and read through LJ, I came across your original post, and it reminded me that I wasn't alone, and that I could get up, and could function, and could get by. So I got up, and went grocery shopping, and fed myself, and generally went about my day. So thank you for your original words, and be damned to anyone who thinks to silence you.

[morningapproach.livejournal.com]

Ugh.  I am so sorry you had to deal with that.  Seriously,  that is so intrusive and rude.  Hugs.

[bookblather.livejournal.com]

Jesus, that's why I quit talking about being depressed in RL, except with a few very specific folks I trust. I'm so sorry you got hit with that.

[alicebentley]

Thank you for your brave post - we probably can't count the number of people who are helped by seeing the inner workings of another person in crisis, but they must be many. I sorrow that there are still multiple people who most probably in their own mind want to help, but take actions that make things worse.

I'm not as brave, or as articulate as you, and I greatly appreciate what you're able to do. Thank you again for writing.

[erik]

Anytime you would like my assistance dealing with such idiocy, I will do my best to be there with a cluebat for them and a Diet Dr Pepper for you.

[dormouse-in-tea.livejournal.com]

As someone who has spent a night locked in a psych ward (thereby almost losing her job, which was oh hey, NIGHT SHIFT) as a consequence of having a fucked up night while on the internet and having a "friend" in another state call the fucking police on her.....I will light a small, vengeful cleansing flame on your behalf. Oi.

I admire you for talking honestly about your depression and your risks. Because it helped me -- if someone so wonderful can have the same problems I do, maybe it's really not just because I actually am a waste of space!

May this year be less painful, to go along with its joys.

[beccastareyes]

Joining in the expression of sympathy. Given that you have many close friends (who I assume read your blog), and the post read like you had found methods to cope and had the support network you needed, I can't imagine thinking you were in enough danger that violating your privacy was even close to justified.

Also, I know I don't know anything about medication* as I am not that sort of doctor (unless you are a moon). Seriously, that's why we have MD programs and residencies.

* Barring 'this is how Drug A affects me'. Even then, I know psychiatric medication can be hella idiosyncratic.

[aliciaaudrey.livejournal.com]

I find Ring Theory helpful when framing how to express concern or support for a person. Someone sent me a link to this article over the summer while my mother-in-law was undergoing cancer treatments (successfully, I am happy to report). It really stuck with me and I think it may be applicable here and present it for public consideration of "how to address a semi-public figure who has expressed something painful to them in a public forum."

http://articles.latimes.com/2013/apr/07/opinion/la-oe-0407-silk-ring-theory-20130407

Money quote: "...But if you're going to open your mouth, ask yourself if what you are about to say is likely to provide comfort and support. If it isn't, don't say it. Don't, for example, give advice. People who are suffering from trauma don't need advice." (sorry for multiple edits, was fighting with broken link)

You expressed that you have been feeling better, for which I am glad. Still, I find Silk's Ring Theory to be broadly applicable whenever someone is talking about a Bad Thing that Happened or Happens Sometimes to them, not just to Someone Is In Crisis Right Now ground, particularly when talking at someone might shove them into a crisis. t changed how I talk to people about Bad Stuff for the better, largely by getting me to talk a lot less and think about what I say a lot more.

[ladymurmur.livejournal.com]

I am so sorry people are being idiots.

ETA: I am so sorry that some people are being idiots. Many of the comments on this and the previous post provide ample evidence that others are being decent and wonderful.

[naamah-darling.livejournal.com]

Like everyone else, I'm sorry.

I talk about this crap, too, and I know how personally draining it is to open up about this sort of thing, and I know how important it is to me to continue doing it, even when it's hard. I appreciate that you seem to feel the same, and deeply appreciate your writing on the subject, which has personally helped me. I appreciate both the cost, and I appreciate the value of it, which is profound. Thank you for being willing to do that.

I am sorry that in their zeal to reassure themselves -- when, IMO, you'd done a fine job of being reassuring -- some people overstepped their boundaries and intruded.

Here are some steampunk pirate ponies who love each other very much, in case you have not seen them already, and needed to see something adorable and awesome to distract you from people's inappropriate overenthusiasm.

Thank you.

[muddlewait.livejournal.com]

It means so much for someone like you to talk about how you're working through the same problems so many of us have. It gives us hope. Thank you.

[fountaingirl.livejournal.com]

Holding space for you, listening, and just holding space.

[wolfsilveroak.livejournal.com]

Well, on one hand, you know people definitely care. On the other hand, it is intrusive and irritating when you never asked for help, but just wanted to get it off your chest, so to speak.

Hugs.

[patternbuilder.livejournal.com]

Today at the closing ceremonies of a filk convention, they announced you would be a guest at the Irish filk convention.
A loud cheer rang out from the crowd.

Just wanted to pass on love from your fans.

[erikagillian.livejournal.com]

This seems like an extreme version of Ally Brosh's dead fish (http://hyperboleandahalf.blogspot.com/2013_05_01_archive.html). [search on fish to find the right part] In her big depression post, (which you may have read, but if not maybe don't read it if you're particularly low as it's a very real and amazing description of depression), she explains how hard it is to talk about depression to 'normal' people. And uses the metaphor of her having some dead goldfish, telling people her goldfish are dead and having people suggest things like helping her find her goldfish. It's very hard to describe depression accurately to people who haven't had it or been around someone who had it and I find Ally's stuff about it very useful. Though she has different symptoms to mine, the general idea is the same.

[valensdragosee.livejournal.com]

Sometimes, I'm still amazed at how incredibly awful human behavior can be. I'm sorry you had to endure this misguided harassment.

I read your post and thought, "It's brave to share something like this. I wish I read something like this much sooner," because it rang true on so many things I've dealt with.

[emerald-ibis.livejournal.com]

I am sorry that people are doing this to you. I did not get the impression that you were unhappy or in danger when you wrote it. I saw that you were stepping up and talking bravely about the pain that you'd been dealing with for the last year or two. I saw hope for yourself and for everyone that the coming year would hold light, peace and happiness for all.

Strange as it may sound, it made *me* feel better about dealing with my own problems. I, too, have been struggling for the last year with similar feelings and it's hard. It makes me afraid that people like you will stop being open about dealing with such problems. There needs to be *more* dialogue about mental illness, not less.

I want you to know that the things that you write are on my own list. "I must stay alive," I tell myself. "I must find out what happens with Toby and Tybalt/read Rose's book/meet Alex Price and find out what's going on with Sarah, Verity and Dominic."

[bill silvia (from livejournal.com)]

That is disgusting, and it taints the fact that I'm making a comment now, when I had intended to do so earlier in the weekend.

Depression is a dangerous thing, all the moreso because people who want to help are likely to hurt more than they help. One of the most unintentionally harmful things someone can ask of a depressed person is "what's wrong" or "why are you so sad", because it forces you to verbalize things you've been avoiding. There are those moments when I feel like if one more person asks me why I'm in a depressive state of mind, I will respond because I am a useless waste of flesh who doesn't deserve to keep breathing and jump into a river that very moment. There are certain things that stop me - largely the fact that I put obligations ahead of my own personal mood and welfare - but those are double-edged swords because the very things that convince me not to take steps that would harm myself are the very things that make me feel like I deserve and/or need it in the first place.

To paraphrase a Facebook post I made earlier today, for a mixture of self-motivation and for a vague hope that someone on my Facebook would indicate some understanding, depression is a state where the smallest thing - a thought, a slight change in body chemistry, a moment or idea - can hurtle you off the edge of a cliff in an instant, and only through a blend of hard work and time can you eventually get back to the top of the cliff for the cycle to repeat. One rarely knows what exactly will help or hurt in the journey to climb past the cliff, as it varies person to person and situation to situation, but shoving someone against the cliff wall and demanding that they stay away from the ravine at the bottom is rarely going to do anything more useful than cause a climber to lose their grip, whether we're speaking literally or metaphorically. I suppose the proper way to continue this metaphor is to indicate that I am offering you trail mix on our perspective climbs, with the intention that it will give us both the energy to avoid falling in, and knowing full well that even those intending to throw a rope to help with the climb more often result in someone scrambling to catch that rope and falling until they can do so.

The only thing I can ask, then, is raisin, or chocolate?

[catalana.livejournal.com]

Holy crap people suck. Personally, I think you have the right to do what you want in your own life, up to and including suicide, if it does not cause others direct harm. Obviously I hope you continue to live, but your life is yours to govern. I can't imagine threatening you to try to get you to live. Particularly when you have basically just given a status update, not a call for help. Ugh. I hate humanity so much sometimes.

(Also: been there myself, and you know how to get in touch if ever you have need of me. I figure you have your support network in place, but...that cartoonist from the Toronto airport will always have a soft spot in my heart. If ever she desires it.)